http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos- An entire Lightstalkers thread via RSS/XML. en-us you are going to like this one: ..."Unsolicited Submission(s) will be deemed, and will remain, the property of XXX and may be used, copied, sublicensed, adapted, transmitted, distributed, publicly performed, published, displayed or deleted as we see fit, and XXX will exclusively own all now known or hereafter existing rights in and to any Unsolicited Submission(s) of any kind and nature throughout the universe in perpetuity, and we will be entitled to unrestricted use of such Unsolicited Submission(s) for any purpose whatsoever, commercial or otherwise, by all means and in all media now or hereafter known or devised, without compensation to you and/or any other sender of such Unsolicited Submission(s). You agree that you are not entitled to any compensation, credit or notice whatsoever in connection with any Unsolicited Submission(s), and you further agree that by sending any Unsolicited Submission(s) you waive that right to make any claim against XXX, its parents or affiliates relating to such Unsolicited Submission(s), including, without limitation, unfair competition breach or implied contract or breach of confidentiality. No Unsolicited Submission(s) will be subject to any obligation of confidence on our party and we will not be liable for any use or disclosure of any Unsolicited Submission(s)." </p> NEXT TIME, READ THE SMALL PRINT. </p></p> Wed, 12 Mar 2008 12:57:10 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos- Hey Guilad-is that the new re-worked Guardian contract? Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:00:12 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114465 Hi john, not guardian. i'd rather not write who it's from here, LS is not really what it used to be. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:07:54 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114466 Strewth-I was only joking about The Guardian of course,(they are re-drawing their agreement with freelance photographers). But you mean this is a REAL T & C for a publication? I'd assumed it was a joke. Even my local BBC who regularly tout for photos of news,events and weather photos, gives the photographer a creditline. I can understand amateurs wanting to see their name flashed up on the telly with no financial reward, but why would anyone give their photos away and agree to have them sold on without even a credit to keep them happy? I'd love to know who is getting away with that Guilad-how about a PM? Promise I won't spill the beans.You can trust me-I'm a photojournalist!! Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:33:02 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114467 But there is the point they are "UNSOLICITED' submissions. Perhaps they are trying to stop people sending them photos they don't want. I mean who sends photos to people without checking whether they want to see them? I mean I will send a link to my website to potential clients, but I wouldn't send pictures unless someone asked to see them. It still sucks the wazoo though, 'cos I guess there always is the 'tempter' pic... Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:41:41 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114468 I used to send unsolicited pics to The Guardian all the time when I was first starting out on national papers-80% of the time they liked them, used them and I got paid :-)) The 20% they didn't use either sold elsewhere or eventually most got sold as stock pics somewhere or other. By the way Lisa, "sucks the wazoo" is a great aussie expression !! Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:45:43 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114469 But JR you probably knew the people you were sending them to, yes? Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:51:59 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114470 Yes, you are of course right in that I had touched base with them beforehand. Wasn't so random that I just sent stuff in without seeing the pic editor and showing him my crappy portfolio previously! Tue, 26 Feb 2008 10:54:48 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114471 I do remember having read this in a publication one of these last months. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 11:07:35 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114472 It's not a joke, it's 100% real. many photographers send a sample pdf or lo-res to email lists by themselves or through distribution services after finishing an "unsolicited" story, hoping someone will bite. this is just the small print, i haven't checked but i'm sure there's more than one company that does that. this one happens to be one of the world's largest. and you really have to search for it, they don't automatically send it to you. </p> "throughout the universe in perpetuity" that'll really tick off my bosses at *The Martian Telegraph*. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 11:24:24 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114475 one(TM), two(R), three(C). i'm just going to trademark everything from now on(TM). Tue, 26 Feb 2008 11:31:59 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114476 Hey Rich-I'm just fine thanks!! Guilad-that's a good idea. I never let any pics out without my copyright warning in the metadata. Surprises me how many photographers distribute their stuff without even checking the copyright box. Even though all my pics go out marked with a legal warning it hasn't stopped a few idiots trying to use them nicked off my website. They have always discovered thats a big mistake when I find out though :-) Tue, 26 Feb 2008 13:56:38 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114486 <i><b>"throughout the universe in perpetuity..."</i></b> no wonder the UFOs dont want to land here. The E.T.s' are sitting, assuming they sit, on the biggest story in Earth's history because they want to make sure they're gonna get paid for the pics. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 14:57:43 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114490 Do E.T's use alien bees? Tue, 26 Feb 2008 15:02:54 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114491 not if they dont have green cards Tue, 26 Feb 2008 15:26:59 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114493 These 'contracts' should be listed under "Achtung, minen!" Tue, 26 Feb 2008 15:31:31 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114496 Why is everyone taking this so seriously when the origin of the quotation is not indicated? Tue, 26 Feb 2008 16:02:24 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114499 Does "in perpetuity" mean uses of the pictures prior to them being taken? I can see this being a big problem with Time Traveller Monthly, who I regularly sell pictures to. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 16:26:14 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114508 "In perpetuity" means "For an indefinite period of time; forever" Tue, 26 Feb 2008 17:05:31 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114519 I think John wants to know if that indefinite period of time covers the past. In other words, can the picture be used, by a time traveler, before it is actually taken? Tue, 26 Feb 2008 19:29:25 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114544 No, it can't. Their grabbing your copyright extends into the past as well. In short, dont even think about taking that picture, bubba, or they'll turn the lawyers loose on you! Tue, 26 Feb 2008 19:43:29 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114548 It's just something about slavery that Guilad dug up somewhere. The chains are virtual. Tue, 26 Feb 2008 21:42:07 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114558 Put the first line, up to the XXX, into google with quotes around it and you'll find the culprit... Looks like a case to attach the Reasonable Agreement to the end of your submissions: "http://smallprint.netzoo.net/reag/":http://smallprint.netzoo.net/reag/ Wed, 27 Feb 2008 08:59:53 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114614 Actually that's not them.they don't even post it online, you have to download a PDF from their website to find out(tm).<br> nothing virtual about these chains(c). Wed, 27 Feb 2008 09:47:03 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114619 hehehehehehe this is a good one *“throughout the universe in perpetuity…â€** sometimes i wonder what drives these people to do such things. is it greed, hatred, sheer stupidity... or what? surgically orchestrated aggression... claiming exclusive rights to your work in small print!!! sad! Wed, 27 Feb 2008 18:44:13 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114654 <b><i>is it greed, hatred, sheer stupidity… or what?</i></b> All of the above, including the what Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:20:04 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114657 Who are you talking about? What is the source of the quotation? Wed, 27 Feb 2008 19:35:27 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114660 Barry: as i said, one of the larger companies(c) (in video and photo) Fri, 29 Feb 2008 05:20:04 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114785 Guilad: Well, that pins it down. Why this uncharacteristic shyness on your part? Fri, 29 Feb 2008 12:40:42 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#114818 Disclaimer: I am no lawyer... however, at least here in Norway such one sided statements doesn't hold. In the so called "Kokkin case" the court spelled it out quite clearly: the copyright holder must explicitly agree to the terms before they can be considered valid. To simply post terms where all sort of rights are grabbed , for example on a website, doesn't automatically make the terms valid/legal. The copyright holder must agree, and the burden of proof is not on the copyright holder, but with the company that claims to have gotten your material for free, to be used "in perpetuity" etc. In other words company X would have to produce a document showing you had signed over you rights, or they can make no such claims. Of course rules are different all over the world.... Mon, 03 Mar 2008 20:34:21 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#115077 Barry: it's called self preservation. (and forebodingness) Mon, 10 Mar 2008 12:01:51 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#115750 Pay the photographer! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj5IV23g-fE Enjoy! Mon, 10 Mar 2008 23:47:58 +0000 http://www.lightstalkers.org/posts/next-time-you-send-photos-#115789