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Fury over Instagram

Fury over Instagram. In the meanwhile, in Facebook’s terms:

“For content that is covered by intellectual property rights, like photos and videos (IP content), you specifically give us the following permission, subject to your privacy and application settings: you grant us a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any IP content that you post on or in connection with Facebook (IP License). This IP License ends when you delete your IP content or your account unless your content has been shared with others, and they have not deleted it.”

No, I’m not on Facebook, never been. Nor have I an Instagram account.

by Laura Larmo at 2012-12-19 10:27:25 UTC | Bookmark | | Report spam→

Now, Instagram says it will change the language of their terms. Of course, they didn’t say they would change the content of the terms. It seems their response to the situation is, “Trust us, we will not do what the terms you accept will allow us to do.”

by Barry Milyovsky | 20 Dec 2012 16:12 (ed. Dec 20 2012) | Manhattan, United States | | Report spam→
!!! Well, did we really expect any other kind of response from them…?

Barry, I so agree with you for what you said on the Lightstalkers on Google+ thread; I too trust basically only Lightstalkers. And I appreciate the fact that there aren’t any moderators or anything and your comments appear in real-time.

I wish I had the money to finance November Eleven/Lightstalkers at least to help them hire a full-time nerd who would keep this site functioning…

by Laura Larmo | 20 Dec 2012 17:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
December 20, 2012
The American Society of Media Photographers (ASMP), Professional Photographers of America (PPA), National Press Photographers Association (NPPA), Picture Archive Council of America (PACA), American Photographic Artists (APA) and Graphic Artists Guild (GAG), trade associations representing professional photographers, graphic artists, illustrators, visual journalists, videographers and other content creators and their licensing representatives, have received numerous objections regarding the proposed change to Instagram’s terms of use.

Organizations Representing Visual Artists Protest Instagram Changes
http://asmp.org/articles/press-release-12-12-20.html

by henley | 20 Dec 2012 17:12 | | Report spam→
…and my point was that I don’t actually understand why everyone is so angry with Instagram now while no-one cares about the Facebook terms and Facebook is full of photos too.

Someone would like to explain this to me…?

by Laura Larmo | 20 Dec 2012 17:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
Well I thought ASMP’s press release is a rather straight forward explanation, it then continues from what I posted above:

The terms provide Instagram with a perpetual right to sell users’ content without payment or notification, and requires the content owner to represent and warrant to Instagram that Instagram’s use will not violate any third party rights, including publicity and privacy rights.

So good luck with that last bit.

by henley | 20 Dec 2012 18:12 | | Report spam→
Yes but if Facebook says “For content that is covered by intellectual property rights, like photos and videos (IP content), you specifically give us the following permission, subject to your privacy and application settings: you grant us a non-exclusive, transferable, sub-licensable, royalty-free, worldwide license to use any IP content that you post on or in connection with Facebook” what’s the difference between Instagram and Facebook?

“Selling” is included in “using” too in theory right?

by Laura Larmo | 20 Dec 2012 18:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
Ah ok now I see that also the press release mentions Facebook as well.

However I don’t understand why this fury now when Facebook has had the said paragraph in their terms for a long time.

by Laura Larmo | 20 Dec 2012 18:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
so just don’t use those silly social media like facebook and instagram… just read the fine print as usual…

by Hans Knikman | 20 Dec 2012 20:12 | Leiderdorp, Netherlands | | Report spam→
I’ve never been on Facebook and I’ve never had an Instagram account – I’m just wondering why so many people are so shocked only because of Instagram.

by Laura Larmo | 20 Dec 2012 20:12 (ed. Dec 20 2012) | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
Hi Laura. I never was in all those social media sites but some days ago I joined Instagram. Was really nice as I stated in my blog because I started to know some banal side of some recognized professionals and a lot of street photography, both my favorites. For me is more easy do good photos when something is happening or the place is beautiful but I like more what we do with common things. There are a lot of nice and fresh photos shared. But after ten days or so happened this. And in spite of all the clamor against the new rules, there are a lot of photographers that continue using the platform as if nothing was happened. I included quit to follow some of them. So, I think that the people is incomprehensible from my point of view. And I found the same you said about Facebook, include I have colleagues who I gave advise, take care that all the things you upload there are usable by the owners of the site. Nobody appears to understand, include some of them ask me, are you sure? mm. As if I was telling a myth. Anyway. Most of the people appears don’t have problems with that. I have problems with that and if they don’t review the terms I will quit. I am sure they don’t give a shit from my quit and all of the people that thinks like me.
About Lightstalkers. I know a lot of good people here. Not business, not exposure, not typical social media. Only good people which I had good conversations or discussions about the themes we like. And I remember a very funny post about fakes prices of the World Press Photo. Anyway, when I talk about social media I remember the song of The Doors, People are Strange.

by Hernan Zenteno | 21 Dec 2012 01:12 | Buenos Aires, Argentina | | Report spam→
To me Facebook is all about promotion. They can use whatever you upload, that’s for sure, so you should watermark heavily anything you upload, or just upload stuff you don’t care that much about. Or use it just to be in touch with friends that live abroad, but when all the Instagram stuff suddenly erupted, I thought, “what the hell, FB is the same and noone seems to worry that much!”

by Patricio Murphy | 21 Dec 2012 21:12 | Buenos Aires, Argentina | | Report spam→
Hernan and Patricio,

glad to hear that I’m not alone with my feelings towards Facebook… or with my feelings that there is something illogical with the behavior of several Facebook/Instagram users.

Usually when I start my Facebook-preaching a very common reply is “you know, everyone’s on Facebook”. So? I don’t understand if it’s fear of being excluded from the world or what. So yes Hernan, I also think People Are Strange.

I also ask almost every time I give someone photos for free not to post them on Facebook; not that I would think that those photos would be particularly beautiful and that they surely would be taken from Facebook, but I ask it mainly out of sheer principle as I’m strongly against that paragraph of Facebook’s terms.

by Laura Larmo | 21 Dec 2012 22:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
Oops! Perhaps I wasn’t clear… I actually do use Facebook, but everything I upload features an annoying watermark. It has worked well to bring visits to my site, and I even got a couple of jobs. So, basically, I’m not against Facebook, it’s just that if you want it to work for you instead of being a source for others to profit from your work, you have to be aware of that terms and don’t upload things you care about, or place that kind of annoying watermark.

by Patricio Murphy | 21 Dec 2012 23:12 | Buenos Aires, Argentina | | Report spam→
Patricio, well yes I understood it but I also understood that you’re not accepting that particular part of Facebook terms with an attitude like “what’s the problem/it’s just fine with me/I don’t care” – otherwise you wouldn’t be putting watermarks…!

by Laura Larmo | 21 Dec 2012 23:12 | Milan, Italy | | Report spam→
Laura, I think most people don’t care about most things. I am not saying that this is such a good situation or even that the things they don’t care about are not harmful, even to themselves. But most people seem to go through life following the messages of the media. So it really shouldn’t be surprising that of the millions using Facebook and Instagram there are a lot of people who don’t care about, or even know about, the terms of agreement.
Also, I am not so sure that there is more fury over Instagram’s terms of service than there is (or was) over Facebook’s. It might be just that Instagram’s statement of it’s terms of service is more recent and, as a result, we are hearing that fury of the moment.

by Barry Milyovsky | 21 Dec 2012 23:12 | Manhattan, United States | | Report spam→
By the way. National Geographic comes back but I check the status of the rules or whatever the name in english and all remain the same. Include there are a happy face published by billmarr that commented: Wellcome back NatGeo Lawyers approve of the revised TOS. There are 48 people that like that. I only don’t understand.
At the same time I want to comment that some people that commented about the good exposure and communication like John Stanmeyer usually publish photos did in a situation that is paid by NatGeo or something. So, there are nothing to lost if the Publisher accord to put this photos like a diary in this kind of sites. But the common freelance that have unkown photos could be damaged by this new rules. One thing is publish a lateral photo of a more big works to make some publicity. Another is have a new job that is not known and put it in the web. For example, I saw the Instagram sites of John Vink and Teru Kuwayama and they published only minor things like photos of the dishes to lunch or children. Ben Lowy in the other side publish very good photos. He is back in Instagram with one photo today. My question is why? I don’t saw any change in the rules. Any help someone?

by Hernan Zenteno | 22 Dec 2012 02:12 | Buenos Aires, Argentina | | Report spam→

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Participants

Laura Larmo, Photographer Laura Larmo
Photographer
Palermo , Italy
Barry Milyovsky, totally unprofessional Barry Milyovsky
totally unprofessional
(emperor of ice cream )
New York , United States
henley, Photographer henley
Photographer
[undisclosed location].
Hans Knikman, Photographer - Filmmaker Hans Knikman
Photographer - Filmmaker
(Moving Media)
Leiderdorp , Netherlands ( AMS )
Hernan Zenteno, Photographer Hernan Zenteno
Photographer
Buenos Aires , Argentina ( EZE )
Patricio Murphy, Musician, photographer Patricio Murphy
Musician, photographer
Buenos Aires , Argentina


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